Hi
I am trying to teach myself fresco painting,so if I ask a stupid question give me a fools pardon HaHa! I was recommended silica sand to add to lime putty, is this suitable and will it give me the fine finnish like marble dust etc. ?

I have aluminium trays 2'.5" * 1'.5" 1" deep, I am going to build the plaster up in them, so I can keep them reasonably low weight, when I finnish I can tip the plaster out and start again.

I would appreciate any advice on the practicality of what I intend to do,would there be any problems using the aluminum trays?

The messages on the topic " whether it is necessary to add c..."
have gave me the push to get started,the information has,to me, been really invaluable, great no nonsence advice.

Thanks
Ed

P.S. Can some one give me a brief description on the methods and materials used to make imitation marble (stucco lustro), I read about it in a book and I'm curious.

Hi Ed!

You need to use washed river sand, silica sand contains mica and will eventually separate and fall off.(mica - any of various colored or transparent mineral silicates crystallizing in monoclinic forms that readily separate into very thin leaves)
To obtain fine sand for the final layer - sift washed riversand through fine screen (window screen works). Also sand must be free from loam, clay, mica, and gypsum.

About your trays - good idea, but how do you plan to get the boards out? (mortar/plaster will stick to it good) you will have to, perhaps, line them up with plastic?. Also you need to use wire mash of some kind - for small panels "expanded metal" is good, in the scratch coat as the support for plaster. Plaster needs support - it is too brittle on its own. I would suggest you use the system posted by Gary in the topic "whether it is necessary to add c..."

Good Luck!

Hi Ilia

Thanks for your advice I will do as you say, I was thinking of keeping the finished work in the tray, if it turned out good enough,but after reading Gary's postings I don't think it would be a good idea. Would I be right in thinking that the water would not be sucked through the plaster.

I got confused with the sand, the silver silica sand made me think it was a different product altogether, how long would it take for the silica to fall off? I ask because someone else used this in a fresco and that was the basis it was recommended to me.

One more question can fresco be carried out on plaster board,if thats the right name for it?

Thanks for your help

Ed

>I got confused with the sand,
>the silver silica sand made
>me think it was a
>different product altogether, how long
>would it take for the
>silica to fall off?

I do not know how fast it will happen. It depends on many things for one - how much of the mica is in it?
Also silica sand might have been quarried by the sea, therefore contain salts and salts are the biggest enemy of fresco. (I am not sure about the last one, but the first one is good enough for me)

Getting revere sand should not be a problem - you do not have to go to the river bank and dig it out. Masonry supply store will tell you where the sand came from, you can use "play sand" it should be river sand and also it comes pre-washed.

>One more question can fresco be
>carried out on plaster board,if
>thats the right name for
>it?

Do you mean "drywall" and what do you want to use it for? As a backing for the fresco plaster coats? I think Gary's system is simple and right and for the small (1-2 sq. feet) panel it is pointless to use any other method. Gary is an expert in "stucco duro" and other plasters.
Just use very little of white cement, and I would not put it into intonaco.

Ilia
http://www.truefresco.com/workshop

I'm sorry for the silly questions, where I live (N.I.) most suppliers and restorers I have talked to don't know what fresco is and they undertake restoration work.

I was curious about the dry wall (plaster board), as most houses (where I live) have stud walls and I was interested to know if fresco can be done on them, considering the books I have read advocate liberal amounts of water, I have a vision of the dry wall falling apart lol.

I do not intend to do any thing over 2' sq as you advised.

ed

Your questions are not silly at all - we all have had those at the beginning.

>I was curious about the dry
>wall (plaster board), as most
>houses (where I live) have
>stud walls and I was
>interested to know if fresco
>can be done on them,
>considering the books I have
>read advocate liberal amounts of
>water, I have a vision
>of the dry wall falling
>apart lol.

In this case dry wall is OK - there is not that much water (if such things happens - it would constitute that the one was making mud pies not fresco LOL). Line it up with black masonry paper and go ahead like it was never there. If the wall has mold ore salt deposits than the best way is to offset your fresco 1-2 inch away from it.

I didn't expect such a fast reply Ilia, it's a pity your workshop does not extend to N.Ireland I for one would be an eager customer.

Ed

Hi Ilia, Hi Ed,
Sorry I picked a late time to jump in, Ilia was answering all your questions. But I wanted to point out that before you start a fresco over an existing surface, make sure that it can take the weight. A three coat plaster will weigh at least 8lbs a sq ft, so it gets real heavy, real fast. There are some wonderful plasterers in Northern Ireland, see if you can get an opinion before you start. I am experimenting with a technique to fresco over drywall but until it has passed my own torture test I am reluctant to pass it on.

Hi Gary
I was being nosey with the drywall question, 8lb/sq ft. thats some weight. The people that I got my lime putty from does a lot of restoration work, but have little knowledge about fresco but more than I have.

I was reading your post "RE: combining sculpturing with pain..." when you said "Now I carve/model in a lime putty/marble dust/white cement mix." may I ask what are the proportions you use.

I was reading about sugar and caseins etc. being mixed with lime putty to make imitation marble, I have got confused with some of the terminology, does stucco lustro = imitation marble, and what is scagliola? I'm trying to keep up with some of the posts on the board but sometimes the names go over my head.

thanks

ed

There is a book by a fellow Brit - Jocasta Innes, called Applied Artistry, 1995. This is an excellent primer for all you ask and more. It should even be in your library system. It is showing up cheap in discount booksellers as well. Scagliola is the high quality imitation marble, stucco lustro is a form of polished or "Venetian" plaster.

Stucco Duro is even deader than fresco - there is no one in North America practising it at this time and the only examples over here are in Spanish Colonial Mexican churches. My own formula is still being adjusted, and I may choose to sell it in buckets, so it is closely gaurded.

Are you mainly a painter or a sculptor?

I usually paint in oils and some airbrush work,nothing spectactular though. I started a faux marble effect on a wall at home,it's turned out good and I want to do a fresco on the opposite wall. My idea was to do three or four 2'sq panels but I have not come up with an idea to frame/tie them together.

I have a lot of time and do not mind "experimenting" as long as I learn along the way, thanks for your book suggestion I'm going to try and get it. Btw I do not think that fresco is an easy thing to do I do recognise the time effort and talent people have to put into their work.

I have Vasari,Cenni and Doerner books they give some details but cut off at the point of interest,the scagliola and stucco lustro and duro descriptions have cleared up a lot of confusion--my head was getting sore trying to keep up.

See ya later

ed

sorry I ranted on a bit